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Thread: Shamu Stadium Maintenance

  1. #21
    Super Moderator carolmc's Avatar
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    I agree with Jill here - just chasing a sensational and one sided story and played on peoples emotional response to animals.


  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by DLB-GOUROCK View Post
    An interesting and different perspective that I found pretty compelling right up to the point that they start saying that Petra were shareholders to "pull a profit". They have publicly stated that they have bought enough stock so that they are able to attend things like the AGM etc. I think it is a little rich to say that they are doing this to try and make money from it...If this was the case they why would they be campaigning against the practises at seaworld and trying to get people not to visit the park? I also think the strange "facebook" research is a bit tenious at best. Somewhat casts a shadow over the credibility of the whole article for me.

    It really is a tough one, on the one hand I get all the stuff about how Seaworld educates through entertainment and uses its resources to help save animals, on the other hand the film creates a really compelling story through the narrative of Seaworld trainers and the people who originally captured Tilly that is hard to watch and still think that what Seaworld does it right. Seeing grown men in tears recalling the suffering that they had put these animals through for our entertainment is hard for me to ignore.

    As I said before, I sort of wish I hadn't watched it as it is now impossible for to get any pleasure out of watching the Orca and Dolphin shows knowing just how much misery and death it takes to bring this "entertainment" to the audience.. We are back in Orlando in March and thankfully there are plenty of other things to do..
    Last edited by FraserLynn; 18-12-2013 at 23:06.


  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by carolmc View Post
    I agree with Jill here - just chasing a sensational and one sided story and played on peoples emotional response to animals.
    Not sure I can agree with you here, I thought it tried to just present the facts through the narrative of the experts. I guess it is one sided in so much as Seaworld declined to be involved, but otherwise I thought it was a high quality documentary. I understand that it has been nominated for an Oscar which suggests that it is considered a very credible film.

    The facts are I guess the facts, Tilly was captured at 2 and taken from his mother, he did live in a tiny park in Canada, he has killed three people whilst he has been kept in captivity (no one has ever been killed by an Orca in the wild), he was dominated by the two female Orcas he was forced to share a very small tank with, Orcas in the wild do cover hundreds of miles and live in tight family groups, calfs do stay with their mothers for life etc etc.

    Which parts did you find sensational?
    Last edited by FraserLynn; 18-12-2013 at 23:13.


  4. #24
    Super Moderator carolmc's Avatar
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    I found that using the deatils from the death of Dawn Branchau - which was quite fresh in the minds of viewers, just "going for broke" and sensational...without the details it would probably have been a reasonable documentary and perhs not have attracted the attention it did. As I said before Seaworld is just small entry in a long list of things to do in Central Florida.


  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by FraserLynn View Post
    Not sure I can agree with you here, I thought it tried to just present the facts through the narrative of the experts. I guess it is one sided in so much as Seaworld declined to be involved, but otherwise I thought it was a high quality documentary. I understand that it has been nominated for an Oscar which suggests that it is considered a very credible film.

    The facts are I guess the facts, Tilly was captured at 2 and taken from his mother, he did live in a tiny park in Canada, he has killed three people whilst he has been kept in captivity (no one has ever been killed by an Orca in the wild), he was dominated by the two female Orcas he was forced to share a very small tank with, Orcas in the wild do cover hundreds of miles and live in tight family groups, calfs do stay with their mothers for life etc etc.

    Which parts did you find sensational?
    That is exactly what they are hoping for from the general public but as already stated our son is a marine biologist and has been alongside SeaWorld with their research and helping rescue and rehabilitate sick and stranded animals so we have more idea than some as to just how much SeaWorld does and how much it costs them. How much footage was given to all those they rescue and restore to full health and release back in the wild again and only those that would not be able to go back to their natural habitat are given permanent homes. Perhaps if more of this was included it would have given a more balanced view for people to weigh up the pros and cons.

    I agree with Carol regarding her comments on Dawn's death and if it was such a well balance documentary the it should not have been necessary to use it.

    Being nominated for an Oscar does not make the content credible it, to me just that it was made to a certain standard. Quite frankly anything Peta are behind cannot be taken seriously when a few years back they were trying to get fish fingers rebranded as sea kittens to try and discourage children from eating fish by portraying them as cute and cuddly!


  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jill View Post
    That is exactly what they are hoping for from the general public but as already stated our son is a marine biologist and has been alongside SeaWorld with their research and helping rescue and rehabilitate sick and stranded animals so we have more idea than some as to just how much SeaWorld does and how much it costs them. How much footage was given to all those they rescue and restore to full health and release back in the wild again and only those that would not be able to go back to their natural habitat are given permanent homes. Perhaps if more of this was included it would have given a more balanced view for people to weigh up the pros and cons.

    I agree with Carol regarding her comments on Dawn's death and if it was such a well balance documentary the it should not have been necessary to use it.

    Being nominated for an Oscar does not make the content credible it, to me just that it was made to a certain standard. Quite frankly anything Peta are behind cannot be taken seriously when a few years back they were trying to get fish fingers rebranded as sea kittens to try and discourage children from eating fish by portraying them as cute and cuddly!
    It is funny how two people can watch the same film and come away with valid, but completely different perspectives... at the very least the film is doing it's job in raising the debate about the issue.

    IMHO, ultimately though Seaworld is not a charity or a not for profit, it is a for profit business so any and all of the rescue work they do will have to be justified through the positive PR they hope to get from it, otherwise they are failing their shareholders. My view (now) is that they have to do this to justify keeping these creatures in captivity for entertainment and profit purposes as this is at the very core of their business model. The rescue work justifies this. When I say this I don't mean the people who work there doing this work, I am sure that they are really committed, hard working and care deeply about the animals that they I working with, I mean the people who pull the strings and allow this to happen.

    Like any argument there are two distinct sides, I think Peta are of course pushing their agenda, that's what they are supposed to do.

    I thought they handled Dawn's death very sympathetically, their suggestion was that Seaworld were sort of trying to blame Dawn and certainly did in court (it was because of the pony tail) but offered some other compelling insights into what may have happened. The amazing thing is that Seaworld are constantly pushing to get the trainers back into the water, despite the clear dangers. They can only be doing this because they thing it makes for a better, more sensational show, which means more ticket and merchandise sales. I guess that they would say that putting the trainers lives in danger gives them more money to spend on rescue work.
    Last edited by FraserLynn; 19-12-2013 at 12:10.


  7. #27
    Gold 5 Star Member Lyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DLB-GOUROCK View Post

    This is more like it. This puts thinks in a much more realistic light. I love Sea World it is my favourite place and I think they do excellent work. I will continue to visit whenever I can. I believe that wild animals belong in the wild, but Sea World as it is now, does not take animals from the wild unless they are injured.
    Lyn


  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyn View Post
    This is more like it. This puts thinks in a much more realistic light. I love Sea World it is my favourite place and I think they do excellent work. I will continue to visit whenever I can. I believe that wild animals belong in the wild, but Sea World as it is now, does not take animals from the wild unless they are injured.
    I think it is a bit much to say that this puts things in a more realistic light. I think it offers a different view, which is of course as valid and clearly is closer to your beliefs (which are equally as valid and I shared before seeing the film) but it should be noted that they are unlikely to be unbiased since it is a website (a poorly written one in my view) that exists because of the theme parks. It is the view of the (unqualified??) writer where as the film portrayed the view of a number of past trainers and field experts.

    I do struggle a bit with the logic that it is OK because Seaworld no longer take animals from the wild. They breed these animals in captivity knowing that they will have a relatively poor existence (compared to the ones in the wild) for commercial benefit, the Orcas are worth millions to them and they are perpetuating the misery. Perhaps if they stopped breeding these animals and committed all of their profits to their research and rescue arm then it would be possible to see them as altruistic. In the current set up it is impossible to ignore (IMHO) that everything they do is calculated to make maximum profit for the shareholders which is their right and dare I say responsibility as a listed company.

    I share the view that this is an unfortunate truth, I too loved the time I spent at Seaworld and as I said early on enjoyed my own blissful ignorance.


  9. #29
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    Today ... http://www.mynews13.com/content/news...ring_for_.html
    SeaWorld caring for manatee rescued near Jacksonville.


  10. #30
    Gold 5 Star Member Andrena's Avatar
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    Don't you think that this discussion has run its course. We all have differing opinions and this just seems to going on and on regurgitating the same old facts. It is getting a bit boring. We are all old enough to make up,our own minds as to whether we want to visit Seaworld or not.

    Andrena


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