I'm with Blott on this one.
If you live abroad, get treatment abroad.
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I'm with Blott on this one.
If you live abroad, get treatment abroad.
I don’t usually like to get involved in these “disagreements”. My friends say that I must have thousands of splinters in my butt from sitting on the fence and trying to see both sides. However, on this occasion, I felt I had to give my two-penneth so please indulge me.
Firstly, I don’t know the full details of John Boy’s medical condition or financial status so wouldn’t like to make assumptions out of turn but I [u]am</u> sure John Boy said, in an earlier post, that he was still paying UK taxes. Wouldn’t this entitle him to receive some form of benefit from the deductions made by our government? I’m a mere mortal who pays ordinary taxes but would like to think that while the government are taking their share of my money that I’d get some sort of benefit from it.
In any event, I don’t think John Boy should be penalised because of massive NHS waiting lists. If you going to compare private health insurance to the NHS, then you surely must agree that even if you don’t presently pay “premiums” to your private health insurer, you are entitled to complete the treatment claimed for under your earlier fully paid up “policy”. It’s not the claimant’s fault that the insurance company has mismanaged the funds and is delaying your treatment nor is it John Boy’s fault that the Government aren’t apportioning enough of our money on the NHS to allow his operation to have taken place eight years ago, when diagnosed.
Phew! Well that’s one splinter I can get rid off![msnwink]
I don't think I'm going to go into this any more as I'm not sure how I can put it any more clearly than I have already. It's not something anyone has against John Boy personally (or anyone else for that matter) but it's the basic principle and these are the current rules.
Paying UK taxes is absolutely nothing to do with eligibility for NHS treatment (it just means that you have some income from the UK and at least £4+k at that or you wouldn't be paying taxes) but residing here is - no matter whether anyone thinks this is right or wrong, this is the situation with current Statutes in the UK. These rules were introduced in 1979, for whatever reason, by a different government than the one we now have here.
It seems mightily unfair to me that people who actually live here currently are waiting for treatment on the NHS but perhaps people living in other countries, who could perfectly well obtain treatment there, are maybe making the wait for UK residents longer or getting in first and for free! I know we live in the 'Welfare State' but that's verging on the ridiculous isn't it? If everyone who was born here and had ever lived here, for any amount of time, was entitled to free NHS treatment when they no longer live here, the people who actually live here wouldn't be able to get it! Fine, if UK residents choose to pay privately, that's their individual choice. But those who can't afford to do that are left with the NHS.
Now, let's just say you'd paid for private health insurance in the UK for many years and never made a claim. This year, you decided you weren't going to live here any more and stopped paying your annual premium. Later on in the year, you found you had a medical problem but you had to pay for treatment yourself in the country in which you were living. So, you came back to the UK just for treatment and gave a UK address but you intended going back to live in the same place abroad. You say to the insurance company - but I've paid in all those years and never claimed anything and now I want you to provide me with treatment. What would the insurance company say to you? They would say that unless you pay your premium each and every year and you live in the UK, you can't claim.
It's a 'free' country and people are entitled to choose to live where they wish and good luck to them, I agree with that principle wholeheartedly. But, along with that freedom of choice comes the responsibility for providing for yourself in that country, not bogging down the NHS getting free treatment to which they're no longer entitled. You're meant to hand back your NHS card when you emigrate - I wonder just how many people do that? When you return here to live, you get supplied with another one - I bet everyone does that!
SARAH,
Thank you so much for your support yes I do still pay my taxies in the UK and receive no benefit whatsoever from them
Yes I also have private medical care for me and my family but unfortunately this was taken out after the hernia started so had to go on the NHS In fact I have today worked out that I have paid in the region of 220,000 Pounds in taxies in the past 8 years and have taken very little from them in return. That’s quite a bit of your wages there Blott.
Anyway I must now thank Blott because he has done more for me than the whole system has in 8 years, Let me explain
For all my bravado in my return thread to you Blott you did get me very worried with what you said and I am sure that someone would have already notified the L&D hospital of this. It’s just the nature of some people to do such things, would you not agree?
So I phoned the NHS and asked them what would be my position and was told the same as Blott has indicated.
So I phoned to make an appointment to see the hospital here in my town (well my wife did as she speaks Spanish)as now I am really woried and was seen that afternoon. WOW NHS IT IS NOT.
So that afternoon I arrived at Hospital and was shown in to see the consultant within 15 minutes of arriving WOW NHS IT IS NOT.
After the doctor had listened to my story (he speaks good English)
He was quite mortified I asked what the cost of the procedure would be and he asked if I was resident I said no but I have lived here for quite some time and he explained that as I had been here for more than 6 months under the EU law I was classed as resident and he could have me in within two weeks and get it fixed WOW NHS IT IS NOT.
Ah but problem I pay tax in the UK and therefore do not qualify for State Treatment 'DARN'
But WAIT he now says that if I see a lawyer and get registered for tax here I can have it done once I have made 6 months payments to the state WOW NHS IT IS NOT.
So today I have seen a lawyer and guess what my TAX bill will be 40% less than it is in the UK and if I register as a company I can get it lower than that OHHH YESSSSS UK THIS IS NOT.
SO THANK YOU BLOTT within 3 days you have helped me do what the NHS has failed to do in 8 YEARS
You should set up as a consultant and make some money out of it, think what you could earn if you did it for a percentage. But then again I think I have already paid the price.
Now to all you patriots that read this and think I am being smug I am not I love England but I don’t like what these politicians are doing to it and doing it with my hard earned money.
I feel like it was no longer the place for me because all I was doing was complaining and every time I complained to a person in authority I just got a knock back so in order not to depress myself and my family any further I have been lucky enough to do something about it so we left.
And now thanks to Blott I can cut all ties with it for good.
No the grass is not greener but it has less insecticide being sprayed on it
Just a final note on this my daughter woke up this morning with both eyes puffed up like golf balls.
Now in the UK I would have taken her to the doctors where I would probably have had to wait an hour to get seen as I had not made an appointment 3 weeks in advance and I would have been presented with a prescription for some eye drops.
I would then have to go to the pharmacy and pay, what!! 6 or 7 pounds for the prescription
Well I took my girl down to the pharmacy at 8.30 this morning as I had an appointment with a Lawyer at 9am and the nice woman there sat my girl down on a seat looked in her eyes checked her temperature and gave me a tube of eye drops and said this would clear it up
Now how much do you think that cost me?
€1.28 less than a quid
Say no more.
<blockquote id="quote" class="ffs">quote:Originally posted by ujpest doza
I'm with Blott on this one.
If you live abroad, get treatment abroad.
[/quote]
SORRY Should that not be
Live in the UK, Can only get treatment abroad[}:)]
Glad to have been of help John Boy and now you know that you've confirmed I was telling you the truth all along! What does worry me is that you didn't find all this out before you went to live in Florida and then Spain and save yourself a lot of discomfort (and money from the tax situation).
I'm looking forward to your report of how much better you feel when you've had it done in two weeks time.
<blockquote id="quote" class="ffs">quote:For all my bravado in my return thread to you Blott you did get me very worried with what you said and I am sure that someone would have already notified the L&D hospital of this. It’s just the nature of some people to do such things, would you not agree?[/quote] If you are inferring I might have done that, then the answer's a definite no as that, too, is also against my principles - I don't think you mentioned a hospital before so I doubt anyone else would have done either!
<blockquote id="quote" class="ffs">quote:Originally posted by ujpest doza
I'm with Blott on this one.
If you live abroad, get treatment abroad.
SORRY Should that not be
Live in the UK, Can only get treatment abroad [}:)][/quote]
No, from what you've said about how marvellous it all is in Spain, I think you'll find that Ujpest Doza was right as you do live abroad and you have him to thank for excellent advice too! [msnsmile2]
I'm really pleased that it's worked out for you, John Boy.
Obviously, mea culpe, I have NO idea how the tax system works when you are talking about that kind of money but I am amazed that you could pay so much tax to our Government and have them consider it a gift. Naive I may be, but I thought that you wouldn't be paying all that tax if you're weren't a resident/citizen of the UK and entitled to the rights & protection that our government affords.
I completely agree that no sensible Brit/UK'er wants to entertain "treatment tourists" or ex-pats who have severed all ties with the UK but still expect to get free non-emergency medical treatment (damn this fence is high!). I obviously didn't make my point clear but I mean't that if you're a resident of the UK when you need treatment, you should get it. You shouldn't have to be on a waiting list for 8+ years and then get told... Forget it, you've moved.... you might still be paying us huge wads of money but that's tough luck....
I was trying to say that if the NHS is to be compared to a private insurance company, then that insurance policy would have paid out at the time, not expect you to wait XX years and then refuse you because your life has moved on. If the NHS wasn't so poorly funded, then John Boy would have had his surgery when he first needed it and we wouldn't be having this discussion. The NHS is amazing, it's just a pity that the Government doesn't seem to appreciate it. It could be so much more.
First: absolutely not I really do believe that your principles would not allow you to do that but I have been around long enough and experienced some very bitter people to know that there are those that would just for the fun of it.
Secondly: I have never said that Spain is marvellous but yes my family and I do have a much better lifestyle here than we did in the UK.
Thirdly: As for my tax situation don’t be worried I never really had the push to cut all ties with the UK But our little conversations here gave me the reasons to make that final cut of the umbilical cord another thing to thank you for
Fourthly: Live in the UK, Can only get treatment abroad!!!!
No I was right in what I said I was referring to an article in a British paper about the amount of people having to have operations abroad on the NHS because it was quicker and considerably cheaper.
And I really do mean THANK YOU
John
<blockquote id="quote" class="ffs">quote:Originally posted by Sarah Seaman
I'm really pleased that it's worked out for you, John Boy.
Obviously, mea culpe, I have NO idea how the tax system works when you are talking about that kind of money but I am amazed that you could pay so much tax to our Government and have them consider it a gift. Naive I may be, but I thought that you wouldn't be paying all that tax if you're weren't a resident/citizen of the UK and entitled to the rights & protection that our government affords.
I completely agree that no sensible Brit/UK'er wants to entertain "treatment tourists" or ex-pats who have severed all ties with the UK but still expect to get free non-emergency medical treatment (damn this fence is high!). I obviously didn't make my point clear but I mean't that if you're a resident of the UK when you need treatment, you should get it. You shouldn't have to be on a waiting list for 8+ years and then get told... Forget it, you've moved.... you might still be paying us huge wads of money but that's tough luck....
I was trying to say that if the NHS is to be compared to a private insurance company, then that insurance policy would have paid out at the time, not expect you to wait XX years and then refuse you because your life has moved on. If the NHS wasn't so poorly funded, then John Boy would have had his surgery when he first needed it and we wouldn't be having this discussion. The NHS is amazing, it's just a pity that the Government doesn't seem to appreciate it. It could be so much more.
[/quote]
Basically Sarah I have been paying the higher rate of tax 40% for all those years but that is just a guess as tax is worked out over several bands but its close enough
There are a lot of people like me that get taxed but don’t get any benefits from the system these people have private medical care and send kids to private school but still pay high tax and NIS contributions but I have never considered it a gift
AS for rights and protections that is now in the hands of the EU not the British government and for that the UK pays 50 million pounds a day to Brussels.
The rest is my thoughts exactly but you put it so eloquently
havent heard from you in a while john boy
anyway i'm off to get my nhs hernia stitched up in durham amoro:D:D
lets hope thats all that gets stitched up?!!
trev