| Author |  Topic  |
gkjones
 United Kingdom
23 Posts
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Status: offline |  Posted - 30 Nov 2007 : 15:43:32  
| Friends of ours were due to travel to Florida for the first time a few years ago. The husband had a conviction for public disorder with a few other of his mates, when he was in his early twenties. He is now in his forties and has a family with no other convictions since. He applied for the visa and went for his interview. The interviewer was very off with him and hummed and arred. Eventually he said he was refusing him the visa. Our friend was totally shocked and pleaded with him to reconsider for his childrens sakes, (he had already booked the holiday and didn't realise he would have to declare his convictions), the interviewer again refused and became quite arrogant with him. Our friend was so upset (he had travelled down and it had taken him 7 hours to get there, with a further 2 hour wait outside in the rain, and this was a couple of years ago), and in his exhausted frame of mind, he stupidly told the interviewer to "go to hell" or words to that effect as he walked off extremely upset.
If he re-applied for the visa, do you think it would be on record that he insulted the interviewer and is there any point in him re-applying. He regrets his reaction to the refusal. I wondered if it was worth suggesting to him to re-apply.
We feel really bad for him and his family, as we have been to Florida several times since then, and we don't tend to talk about how fantastic Florida is to him. But it would be great if they could come with us some time. | | Report this post to a moderator |
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Clare R
United Kingdom
661 Posts
Joined: 25 May 2004
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roger
 United Kingdom
3763 Posts
Joined: 21 Jan 2002
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derek gibson
 USA
57 Posts
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
Status: offline | Posted - 30 Nov 2007 : 18:42:28
| | hi I got refused but reapplied and I got the visa ,each case is different, he could not travel on the waiver because of his arrest so he has to apply, it seems to me it depends on the mood of the staff because I have been to London 3 times refused once and got a visa twice so it is very random in my opinion, as for his remarks in his last interview I was told that they only judge on what is in front of them not on previous cases hope this helps |
del | | Report this post to a moderator | goto top of page |
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Frosty
 USA
795 Posts
Joined: 15 May 2004
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gkjones
United Kingdom
23 Posts
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Status: offline | |
derek83
United Kingdom
5 Posts
Joined: 07 Sep 2003
Status: offline | Posted - 29 Jan 2008 : 19:56:15
| Hi hilst it certainly must be frustrating for your friend to be denied a visa and thus access to all that Florida has to offer,it does make one think that if he cannot control his temper in front of a government official from whom he must have known it would have profited him to be of his "best behavior" ,then how on earth would he show self restraint in far more challenging circumstances that may arise against a third person if he did get to Florida?
You mentioned that it had taken him 7 hours to get to the embassy and 2 hours to wait for interview,well lord knows that those of us whom have traveled to Florida know that the flight itself is a minimum 8 hours with at least a further 2 hours to get through immigration along with over pedantic immigration officers most of whom are often rude ,then you have the extended wait for baggage claim and the rental car collection AND ALL this before you get onto the freeway.Even the most reserved of us are fractious and bad tempered by the time we arrive at our Florida destination!
Your friend with a previous conviction for a public order act offense which is defined as " Using or threatening aggressive abusive insulting words or behavior likely to cause harassment alarm or distress ",would appear a VERY likely candidate to present a problem to authorities or other holiday makers at any stage of their holiday.
Using the excuse that it was 20 years ago is hardly relevant when he still insists on being abusive and insulting to an American Official.
Using the excuse he was tired is also hardly credible when you take into consideration that we all have to go through that and more every time we travel to Florida.
Whilst i feel for the family and being a "hot head " myself at times ,this gent seems unable to control himself during the important time of an interview which would ultimately decide his access to the USA.
Maybe the official deliberately set out to wind your friend up and antagonize him to test his self restraint ......IT APPEARED HE FAILED,much to the detriment of his family.
People ,merely suggesting ways around getting a visa may not remove his anger management issues and MAY ultimately cause problems for holiday makers and home owners in Florida at a later date should he merely decide to show a distinct lack of self restraint and direct his anger at us .
Im sorry but i disagree with your underhanded suggestions to get people like this into Florida. |
Derek H Ewart | | Report this post to a moderator | goto top of page |
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alastair
![]() 157 Posts
Joined: 22 Jun 2004
Status: offline | Posted - 29 Jan 2008 : 21:16:24
| quote:
Originally posted by derek83
with at least a further 2 hours to get through immigration
I don't know anyone who has taken at least 2 hours to get through immigration on arrival in Florida. Have you never got through in less than that? | | Report this post to a moderator | goto top of page |
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ShirleyD
 United Kingdom
5167 Posts
Joined: 21 Mar 2005
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erowlands
United Kingdom
394 Posts
Joined: 18 Aug 2004
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steph_goodrum
 United Kingdom
6659 Posts
Joined: 12 Feb 2002
Status: offline | Posted - 30 Jan 2008 : 07:32:28
| | When we went Christmas we also were en route to the villa within 30 mins of landing. Literlally 2 mins through immigration and th emost pleasant officer we have ever had. Made a huge difference not having to put the cases on the second carousel (you can't take trolleys on the transit but can now take your cases on), also Dollar Express whisks you to the front of the queue and saves even more time. |
Babblin Boo
http://www.orlandovillas.com/villas/92.aspx
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canarypam
 United Kingdom
870 Posts
Joined: 10 Dec 2003
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sunandfun
United Kingdom
51 Posts
Joined: 17 Apr 2005
Status: offline | Posted - 30 Jan 2008 : 20:42:48
| | We also had a very quick passage through Miami immigration at Christmas, and the immigration officer was extremely pleasant. He also only asked one question about where we were staying and he gave us some great tips about Key West. | | Report this post to a moderator | goto top of page |
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nshalaw
![]() United Kingdom
3 Posts
Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Status: offline | Posted - 12 Mar 2008 : 16:19:20
| I am a US Immigration Attorney in Birmingham, UK. The Embassy officials can be rather abrupt. The Embassy tends to be harsh on people with a conviction or even an arrest. To obtain the visa you need to show that you have strong ties to the UK and that you have not engaged in any criminal behaviour for the past five years. In many instances, the five year rule does not apply.
If a person has ever been arrested, he/she cannot travel to the US under the Visa Waiver Program. Even a person with a spent conviction requires a visa. He/she cannot travel under the Visa Waiver Program
Nilay
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Tonish
 United Kingdom
307 Posts
Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Status: offline | Posted - 19 Mar 2008 : 21:31:35
| quote:
nshalaw Posted - 12 Mar 2008 : 16:19:20
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am a US Immigration Attorney in Birmingham, UK. The Embassy officials can be rather abrupt. The Embassy tends to be harsh on people with a conviction or even an arrest. To obtain the visa you need to show that you have strong ties to the UK and that you have not engaged in any criminal behaviour for the past five years. In many instances, the five year rule does not apply.
If a person has ever been arrested, he/she cannot travel to the US under the Visa Waiver Program. Even a person with a spent conviction requires a visa. He/she cannot travel under the Visa Waiver Program
Nilay
Nilay, good to hear from you.
As an immigration attorney you can add a lot to this forum. The visa waiver rules are certainly open to interpretation, to say the least. I hope you're not just "passing through" as it were.
Would you mind, if you're still checking this thread, commenting on "once a visa, always a visa?"
I should give you a few more details - my lovely wife, innocent and blameless as a newborn, unfortunately managed to get herself a speeding conviction a few years ago (no arrest involved). She got a visa on the basis that the website says you need to apply if you have been arrested and/or convicted.
We have since decided that she should not have applied for a visa, as she can truthfully answer all the questions on the waiver form with a no, and we genuinely believe she's not really the intended target for a visa.
Her passport is coming up for renewal and if she does not get the visa renewed in the new one, can she go in visa free and sign the waiver? Or will there be problems...?
Appreciate your thoughts |
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Robert5988
United Kingdom
1438 Posts
Joined: 15 Apr 2004
Status: offline | Posted - 19 Mar 2008 : 23:57:07
| quote:
If a person has ever been arrested, he/she cannot travel to the US under the Visa Waiver Program. Even a person with a spent conviction requires a visa. He/she cannot travel under the Visa Waiver Program
Nilay
I wonder if you could also comment please on a couple more points.
Most people on this site are aware of the entry on the US Embassy website for UK that clearly states if you have ever been arrested you need to apply for a Visa.
However there is of course absolutely no requirement for anyone to look at the website, or even know it exists; and in any case I understand it doesn't have similar wording about arrests in some US Embassy websites for other countries.
The vast majority of visitors simply look at the relevant question on the Visa Waiver form(I-94W) with its reference to "crimes of Moral Turpitude' and 'sentences of confinement of 5 years or more'.
Reading that question it is competely reasonable to answer No even if you have been arrested for a minor offence(or found not guilty). If the form meant "any arrest", why refer to crimes of Moral Turpitude and confinement?
Wading through the US regulations
http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/travel/id_visa/business_pleasure/vwp/vwp.xml
There is nothing that I can see that stipulates an arrest of any sort disqualifies a visitor from entering under a waiver.
So my question:
Are you aware of any regulation that states unequivocally that any arrest means you cannot enter under a waiver? Obviously excluding the guidance(not regulation) in the US Embassy website for UK.
There is of course the suspicion that the US Embassy need to justify their staffing levels and unnecessarily dragging us to London(or Belfast) achieves that aim.
I did write formally to the US Embassy with that question and after promting got back a reply that completely evaded my question. Along the lines of "if you cannot understand the waiver form and regulations you should attend for an interview"
There are plenty of anecdotal tales of US Immigration officials at the point of entry simply not believing that people had applied for a Visa because they got arrested 30 years ago for a minor offence and were not even charged, or found not guilty.
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Edited by - Robert5988 on 20 Mar 2008 07:56:00 | | Report this post to a moderator | goto top of page |
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steph_goodrum
United Kingdom
6659 Posts
Joined: 12 Feb 2002
Status: offline | Posted - 20 Mar 2008 : 08:20:32
| "However there is of course absolutely no requirement for anyone to look at the website, or even know it exists; and in any case I understand it doesn't have similar wording about arrests in some US Embassy websites for other countries.
There is a requirement though, Robert, for any person who wishes to travel to any Country in the World other than their place of residence to find out the entry requirement of that country and ensure whether they are eligible to travel or if a VIsa is needed.
Australia has for many years had the ETA requirement and it is up to an individual (whether via their travel agent or however) to ensure their compliance. Ignorance is not counted as an excuse, if a person is responsible enough to book an airline ticket they should also be capable of finding out if they need a Visa. |
Babblin Boo
http://www.orlandovillas.com/villas/92.aspx
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Robert5988
United Kingdom
1438 Posts
Joined: 15 Apr 2004
Status: offline | Posted - 20 Mar 2008 : 13:32:29
| quote:
There is a requirement though, Robert, for any person who wishes to travel to any Country in the World other than their place of residence to find out the entry requirement of that country and ensure whether they are eligible to travel or if a VIsa is needed.
Absolutely - I couldn't agree more.
My point is that the formal regulations for entry requirement are contained in the US Immigration website link I gave and, unless I am much mistaken and have missed where it is laid down, that does not stipulate an arrest disqualifies you from entering on a Visa Waiver.
Why having read all the detail in that official site, would I seek further guidance from the US Embassy website in UK? As said above my further point was that I might not even know that website exists.
In any case the US Embassy websites in the various countries eligble under the Visa Waiver schemes give different guidance and all refer to the US Immigration regulations as their authority.
So from reading the official US Immigration website an arrest would not debar you from entry on a Visa Waiver.
Likewise reading the I-94W would not debar you from entry; unless you had committed a crime of moral turpitude or spent 5 years in Jail.
Apart from the above, it is patently absurd to to have the situation that any arrest, even in a case of mistaken identity, would deny someone the use of a Visa Waiver; and as far as I can ascertain the formal regulations do not stipulate that is the case.
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Edited by - Robert5988 on 20 Mar 2008 13:37:07 | | Report this post to a moderator | goto top of page |
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Katys Grandad
![]() United Kingdom
1104 Posts
Joined: 11 Oct 2004
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roger
United Kingdom
3763 Posts
Joined: 21 Jan 2002
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Frosty
USA
795 Posts
Joined: 15 May 2004
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Visa refused
